I got the homophobia blues
February 8th 2009 09:44
"...probably homophobic."
A phobia is an irrational, intense, persistent fear of certain situations, activities, things, or people. The main symptom is the excessive, unreasonable desire to avoid the feared subject. (Wikipedia)
I am so over the constant labelling of anyone who disagrees with us as “homophobic.”
Someone I know has bird phobia. If a bird lands anywhere near him he freezes. I will tactfully draw a veil over the scene when an inquisitive emu decided to stroll alongside him as he toured Healesville sanctuary.
Booking hotels is a nightmare because all pillows and doonas must be synthetic – a stray feather could send him frantic. That’s a phobia.
Therefore a person with homo-phobia would display an intense irrational fear of homosexuals and an excessive unreasonable desire to avoid them.
The man who bashes the gay man who makes a pass at him probably is homophobic. But the vicar who opposes same-sex marriage because it isn’t in the bible, probably isn’t.
The word is flung around far too readily. Anyone disagrees with us must be homophobic. I don’t think so.
It’s a particularly cheap and nasty insult. It labels the other person as irrational, unamenable to reason, and affected with a psychiatric disorder. It’s nothing more than the old playground taunt, “You’re a loonie!” dressed in pseudo-scientific drag.
It says to the other person, “because you are mentally ill your arguments are worthless.” Brilliant! Two birds with one stone! Trash your opponent and put down the mentally ill with a single phrase!
On top of that, it’s sloppy and lazy. Don’t bother making a coherent case, don’t look for ways to counter the other person’s arguments. Just click your heels together and say “there’s no word like homophobia”, and you’re instantly back in fairyland.
It’s not a phobia – it’s prejudice. It’s hatred and dislike, stemming mainly from ignorance. And as a community we ought to know know all about prejudice. Not just because we’re on the receiving end: we’re full of it ourselves.
A quick trawl through a couple of online dating sites this afternoon – purely for research purposes, of course - brought up the following bottom-dwellers flourishing in the sludge.
There were plenty of race-phobics about: “No curry and no rice.” “Lookin to hook up with sexy men that are NOT FEMININE or ASAIN” (sic) And my personal favourite: “Australians only – no blacks or Asians.”
But it’s the age-phobics who display classic phobia symptoms – irrational fear coupled with avoidance and aggression.
“Gobstopper!! READ MY PROFILE!! No guys that can be as old as my Dad!!” “No-one old enough to be my dad ‘cos it’s creepy.” “I won’t answer anyone over 23.”
They sound a lot like the homophobic sailor who’s just felt a bloke’s hand on his knee.
So let’s make a pact with ourselves: we’ll stop stigmatising our opponents as a bunch of loonies, we’ll stop stigmatising black and asian rainbow folk as inferior, and we’ll stop stigmatising older members of our community as a bunch of dirty old men.
We get enough of that from the straights.
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Comment by Wilson Pon
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Comment by Mountain Fog
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QUOTE ME NO QUOTES!
HEAR! HEAR! Well said! I have had to point out the difference between phobia and hatred myself, on a number of occasions.
Just like xenophobia, it does not mean the eprson is a card carrying KKK member, but, suffers from an irrational fear of foreigners.
Sadly, today, too many words of specific meaning are diluted and exchanged, or just misused, till they become quasi-accepted into the language.
By the way, that sailor looks decidedly non-homophobic, nor does he look like a gay hater...(ok, so the word 'gay' has been adopted by us, true, and my father rued the day, for he said it was a delightful description, of someone light of temper and joyous).
I guess that's why we stole it...
cheers
fog
Comment by Morgan Bell
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noun
irrational hatred or fear of homosexuals or homosexuality
ho·mo·pho·bi·a
n.
1. Fear of or contempt for lesbians and gay men.
2. Behavior based on such a feeling.
homophobic
Adj.
1. Prejudiced against homosexual people
i disagree with you here
regardless of someones reason for being prejudiced or hateful towards homosexuals, if they actively petition for gays to be afforded less than equal rights as straight people then they are exhibiting homophobia
the word "homophobia" is not simply the sum of its parts, it carries with it a specific meaning which is well defined to include contempt and discrimination
if you were going to take the word completely literally it would translate to "fear of humans"
if someone holds the opinion that a gay person is entitled to less than a straight person they are basically saying you are a second-class citizen based on your sexuality
these kind of opinions are based on the misconception that homosexual behaviour is an "unnatural choice" that can be stopped if it is condemned
hatred of gays stems from homophobia, but not all homphobia is as extreme or blatant as gay hate crimes
some homophobia is ignorance, some is superiority, some is disgust and disdain, some is the wish to erradicate or minimise exposure to
gay people themselves can be homophobic, including internal homophobia
i also dont think that a few racist gay people should excuse or condone homophobic actions against the queer community at large
Comment by Mountain Fog
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QUOTE ME NO QUOTES!
while we are indulging in english word definitions, let's be accurate about this word's beginnings and original meaning;
the word "homo" originally stems from the Greek, "homos" which means same.
"phobia" is from the Greek "phobos", meaning fear.
An english use of "homo" would be;
homogenous; meaning of the same kind, uniform. (Shorter Oxford Dictionary)
hence;
homosexual; having a sexual propensity for persons of the same sex. (Shorter Oxford Dictionary)
Ergo, homophobia is, a fear of the same.
Being a relatively recent addition to the english language, 'homophobia' was coined by a psychologist, (George Weinberg), in 1972, an extract of his dissertation on this word, which he stated was a medical condition, is as follows;
a phobia about homosexuals….It was a fear of homosexuals which seemed to be associated with a fear of contagion, a fear of reducing the things one fought for — home and family. It was a religious fear and it had led to great brutality as fear always does. (sourced Wikipedia)
So no, I do not agree with Morgan, that the word homophobia literally translates into a definiton of hatred, far from it, however, fear can, and often does, lead to exacting terrible violence against the feared person, for whatever reason.
I believe, if indeed it is at all necessary, a new word could be coined to delineate between a morbid hatred of gays, and, fear of gays through ignorance or religious upbringing etc.
Of course, most people who exact and/or extol violence and hatred, we can usually label them as psychopaths.
English is a wonderful language, it keeps adding words, keeps evolving, so, in almost a moment of self-capitulation in this argument, I can see how and why the word homophobia has been adapted by interested groups, to mean hatred of gays.
Pity though, for ignoring the fact that homophobia is a mental illness, deserving of help and sympathy, only serves to build another wall, against the opportunity of addressing and helping people with such fears, so they can learn to adjust and eventually live happily alongside homosexuals.
I have had many an experience, of both hatred and phobia, one such, of the latter, was rather touching;
I was asked by a straight guy, who wanted to start a relationship with a close female friend of mine, whether I would mind. (I found out much later that my friend had told him, if I did not approve of him, it was off! She adored me...sigh..what can I say!!??)
Of course, I was surprised he asked me and, naturally, told him I did not mind. Later on that night, drunker and with his best mate, he came up to me and said, "You're the first gay guy we have gotten to know and we just wanna say how much we like you!" They then both drunkenly hugged me, one spilling a small quantity of beer over my left buttock, as they swayed while they clutched me.
At first, I was a little taken aback, for it came across to me as a back-handed compliment, but, quickly seeing it from their point of view, I felt rather honoured. These guys were phobic of homosexuals because of no contact and the general societal attitude of the day; religion and the law forebade homosexuality, at best, it was a mental illlness, but you were still prosecuted.
The younger gays of today do not realise what life was really like back then.
So, the wholesale branding of them as all being haters only serves to further marginalize the phobic (mentally)afflicted, to a place of no help. Gays, afterall, should be more sensitive about the experience of being marginalized.
This topic, by the way, is really about word 'usage', and how it changes definitions of words over time...sometimes for the better, sometimes not...
cheers
fog
Comment by Doug Pollard
Current Affairs
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I have never been comfortable with the psychiatric term itself, which appears to be a medicalistion of the discredited legal defence of 'homosexual panic', where a straight man reacts to having a pass mnade at him by beating or even killing the gay man who propositioned him.
So I'm unsure about the psychiatric validity of the term in the first place. To then take that term and expand it to demonise your political opponents strikes me as irresponsible and to an extent hypocrtical - even though for years I have uneasily accepted the expanded definition you lay out, Morgan, and used it myself.
I don't think racist and ageist gays excuse homohpobia - but if we are going to complain about other people's prejudice against us, we ought also to examine our own prejudices.
Once again, thanks both. Fascinating stuff.
Comment by Morgan Bell
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oh very right - the Greek translation is the more appropriate in this case
however my point is still the translating the parts of a words often does not adequately make its definition
from the wikipedia:
A number of terms with the suffix -phobia are primarily understood as negative attitudes towards certain categories of people or other things, used in an analogy with the medical usage of the term. Usually these kinds of "phobias" are described as fear, dislike, disapproval, prejudice, hatred, discrimination, or hostility towards the object of the "phobia". Often this attitude is based on prejudices and is a particular case of general xenophobia.
Class discrimination is not always considered a phobia in the clinical sense because it is believed to be only a symptom of other psychological issues, or the result of ignorance, or of political or social beliefs. In other words, unlike clinical phobias, which are usually qualified with disabling fear, class discrimination usually has roots in social relations.
Chemophobia - prejudice against artificial substances in favour of "natural" substances.
Christianophobia - fear or dislike of Christians or Christianity.
Ephebiphobia - fear or dislike of youth or adolescents.
Gynophobia - fear or dislike of women.
Homophobia - fear or dislike of homosexuality.
Xenophobia - fear or dislike of strangers or the unknown.
and just to clarify
i dont think the words "hatred" and "homophobia" are synonymous, i think hatred of gay people falls under the umbrella of homophobia, but it is possible to be homophobic without committing gay hate crimes
anyway, Doug, what im basically saying is that the word "homophobia" does not describe a psychological medical condition, it describes negative social attitudes
i agree with you in essence, but i think that sentiment should apply to straight people as equally as it does to queers, we should expect no less and no more
also when it comes to matters of sexual preference i dont think its appropriate to judge what physical attributes turn people on . . . some people just arent attracted to skinny, fat, tall, short, hairy, shaved, young, old, dark, pale, lazy, fit, etc people, they may not want to enter into relations with someone who has opposing political or religious views or language barriers
if it was the workplace i would agree with you, but when it comes to who you want to invite into your bedroom i think people have the right to be as selective as they want on a dating site . . . straight dating sites let you check boxes for which races, heights, weights, and ages are preferrable, so i dont think its unique to the queer community
thanks for the discussion fellas
Comment by Doug Pollard
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If you say 'hot for blue-eyed blonds' that's a preference: if you say 'no blacks', that's a prejudice.
It's not what you say, it's the way that you say it. People should use more sensitivity - or simply not reply to people who don't fit their desires. Or use the (usually) free options of sending a 'thanks, but we don't match' message.
It's unthinking and mannerless, at the very least, to state a list of exclusions.
Comment by Morgan Bell
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if you are talking about Gaydar or something similar, ive seen older gay gentlemen mercilessly hassel younger guys, sending message after message, ignoring polite rejections, until they have to be blocked
they obviously ignore subtle preference statements, so the younger guys alter the wording to be more and more blunt
its one of those situations where respect works both ways
on the race thing i have to disagree, i think its really common for all sorts of people to only date from within their own race, or to fetishise a particular race . . . if you dont like that about a person then dont answer their ad
i know everyone has different opinions on this, and many people frown on it but i dont personally . . . it definately is a prejudice, but when it comes to sexuality you cant force people to do things theyre not comfortable with
Comment by alt_ed
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Either way Doug, does this really concern you? Aren't you in a monogamous grandfatherly relationship?
Oh well, lets just say I'm a prejudiced homophobe!
Comment by Doug Pollard
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